Editor's note: Since 2021, Professor Zhi Fina of the Chinese Academy of Arts has been accepting exclusive interviews with Pengpai News reporters as soon as the Spring Festival period ends, reviewing the problems in the film market last year, analyzing the gains and losses of this Spring Festival period, and making prospects for the film market in the new year.
The interview is published in two parts, the upper and lower parts. This article is the lower part.
【dialogue】
If we don’t reform, we will die. It is imperative to issue products in different lines.
The Paper: In 2024, Chinese films encountered many setbacks. What self-rescue or innovative measures have you observed the industry take?
Zhi Fina: I may pay more attention to the trends of management than other scholars. In mid-2024, there were some changes in the general direction of guiding film management, and the film industry further sought internal reform. My observation is that management has strengthened internal industry exchanges more than in previous years, visited crews more often to inspire people, and conducted more in-depth market research in cities and rural areas. In addition to focusing on improving the quality of creation, some new ways of playing have also been created to stimulate the vitality of movies and attract the attention of young audiences.
From February 2024 to January 2025, the management launched "Movies + Finance", and joined hands with the Central Bank Digital Currency Institute, Industrial and Commercial Bank of China and China UnionPay to start with issuing consumer coupons to benefit the people, promote wider financial cooperation, introduce financial liquidity, and gradually break the situation where finance and movies are "unrelated but never interact with each other". This activity has also received positive responses from local management departments and the financial industry. It is hoped that in the future, finance can change the situation where the upstream capital pool and the self-owned capital pool of Chinese films are facing depletion.
On June 16, 2024, the management launched "Movies + Postal Service", printing the well-known "Dragon Logo" on stamps. Film producers and audiences can also spend very little money to print designated patterns on the stamp sub-tickets and get exclusive "Dragon Logo" stamps. Although it is only a stamp with a face value of 1.2 yuan, the "Year of the Dragon + Dragon Logo + 616" small product has changed the stereotype of ordinary people about the "Dragon Logo" to a certain extent.
During the 26th Shanghai International Film Festival, the "Chinese Film" personalized service stamps were officially issued
In January 2025, the management launched the "Movies + Food" campaign, allowing catering companies and film companies to jointly launch a "Follow the Movies to Taste Food" consumption promotion campaign. Subsequently, the "Movies + Travel" campaign was launched at the filming location of "Detective Chinatown 1900", guiding the audience to "follow the movies to travel", and many places across the country can enjoy ticket discounts with movie tickets. It can be said that for ordinary people, movies must not only be good-looking, but also delicious and fun, and if they can also get free stuff, it would be even better.
The Paper: In addition to the management innovations you mentioned, what is the driving force behind the reform in the industry? You mentioned the split-line distribution. How has it worked in the past year?
Zhi Fina: In October 2023, the industry began to explore the split-line distribution. New things inevitably take detours, so when we interviewed during the 2024 Spring Festival, I said "dividing the market is not split-line distribution." Over the past year, there have been all kinds of voices, including doubts, ridicule, complaints, and boycotts. But in the second half of 2024, everyone understood that if we don't reform, we will die, and split-line distribution is imperative.
We have seen that some niche films have been screened in one theater for a long time, such as "Kangxi and Louis XIV"; some classic films are only screened in high-quality theaters, such as the re-screening of the entire "Harry Potter" series in more than 3,000 theaters; some theaters have tried to screen the theater version of concerts, such as "Taylor Swift: The Time Tour" which will start on December 31, 2023, as well as "Queen Live in Montreal" and "Zhang Jieyao Beidou Tour Concert"; some theaters even hold concerts, live broadcast e-sports finals, play "Black Myth: Wukong" games, and hold offline promotional activities for TV series. Whether the effect is good or not, the market knows best.
The essence of split-line distribution is to refine and diversify distribution, so that those personalized films, theaters and audiences can find each other. When there are not enough blockbuster programs, we need to operate flexibly and survive first. We will continue to explore this year.
Return to the original intention of internal reform and external opening up
The Paper: Adhering to the unity of reform and opening up is the dialectical wisdom of Chinese modernization. In addition to the outstanding performance of "Catch the Doll" in the summer of last year, many people did not expect that the imported film "Alien: Taken" would become the biggest dark horse at the end of this period. Of course, it is not just this film. I also noticed that when many films were released last year, the theaters or publicity agencies put up notices that "audiences under 18 should choose to watch with caution", but this did not hinder the enthusiasm of their target audiences to watch movies.
Zhi Fina: In 2024, imported films will continue the "multi-national, diversified" approach, basically covering the world's high-grossing, highly acclaimed and excellent films that value the Chinese market. At the same time, I think there are still three obvious changes.
First, the number has recovered significantly. In 2024, 76 imported films will enter the market, plus 7 Hong Kong films and 9 Taiwan films will enter the mainland market through the imported film channel, so there will be a total of 92 imported films, higher than 85 in 2023, 57 in 2022, and 74 in 2021.
Second, the settlement price of imported films has increased, which means that the minimum selling price of imported films in the Chinese market has increased. The so-called settlement price, or the guaranteed release price, refers to the lowest price that the film exhibitors (cinema chains, theaters) and film producers (production, publicity and distribution) settle accounts at.
For a long time, the settlement ticket prices of imported films have been lower than those of domestic films. For example, the settlement ticket prices of top international productions such as "Avatar: The Way of Water" are only 25-30 yuan. The settlement ticket prices of a number of domestic small and medium-cost films are all above 30 yuan, and many big-ticket films are even as high as 55 yuan. Hollywood film producers hope to increase the settlement ticket prices. After consultation and coordination among all parties in the market, in January 2024, the settlement ticket price of the American B-level film "The Beekeeper" was raised to 30-40 yuan. This change not only shows the inclusive mentality of the Chinese film market after its maturity and is more friendly to imported films, but also helps to better build a market environment of fair competition and international integration.
Third, the audience has more demands for content. In the past, many people always felt that imported films were a scourge, that they would boost others' morale and destroy their own prestige, and they liked to "exaggerate" their evaluations, and even suppress the imported film market. In recent years, due to the convenience of online channels, audiences have seen more abundant content online. So when they see the expected content on the big screen, they feel the satisfaction of spiritual consumption. As you said, many excellent imported works released in 2024 have been welcomed by the audience. First, in March, the Taiwanese film "Zhou Chu Eliminates Three Evils" was released, which aroused widespread acclaim. Many people exclaimed: "Is this something I can watch in the cinema?" The effect is that a large number of Hong Kong and Taiwan films are queuing up to come to the mainland market to get better box office returns and audience reviews.
According to Maoyan Professional Edition data, the movies "Yuanyanglou: The Terror", "Alien: Rescue Ship" and "Zhou Chu Eliminates Three Evils" have become the three major box office dark horses in 2024
During the release of Alien: Taken Last Summer, audiences kept telling each other that it would scare the kids. In addition, Joker 2: Double Delusion, Gladiator 2, and Mad Max: Fury have magnificent and tense scenes, allowing everyone to fully experience the charm of the big screen in depicting pursuit, fantasy, and war. Of course, not all of them are box office hits. For example, Napoleon sold well abroad, but the domestic box office was only 27.88 million yuan. So, it still depends on the content.
I think that the reason why good films can achieve success in the Chinese market is, on the one hand, because of the confidence of decision-makers in Chinese culture and their full trust in ordinary audiences. More than 20 years of film reform and opening up have given management courage and confidence, but it is also inevitable because of the increasing spiritual and cultural needs of ordinary audiences.
The Paper: Judging from the reminder that “it will scare children”, does it also indicate that the audience’s understanding and tolerance of film art is gradually improving, and that the market also has the wisdom to make corresponding adjustments?
Zhi Fina: It should be said that as long as imported films that have passed the censorship and entered the Chinese market are in line with the core socialist values. The Chinese market is deep and the acceptance standards of first- and second-tier cities and fifth- and sixth-tier cities are different. The content of the film should try to cater to as many audiences as possible, because movies are for a broad audience rather than a narrow audience. The more audiences accept it, the better.
Some scenes in some films do not conform to social order and morality, so some technical processing is needed to make it more acceptable to the Chinese market. There is nothing wrong with this. For example, in Oppenheimer two years ago, there was a scene where the heroine had a long shot of being completely naked. In the Chinese version of the film, the director personally used post-production methods to put a little black dress on her. When I took my children to watch it, I was very calm, but when my classmates in Hong Kong took their children to watch it, they quickly covered their children's eyes. There are many similar cases, and the facts prove that everyone can understand and support it.
The Paper: Only with sufficient self-confidence can we generate sufficient tolerance.
Zhi Fina: Yes. Although the box office performance in 2024 was not satisfactory, I think that in 2024, Chinese films have taken an unprecedented big step in opening up to the outside world. It is a new starting point and a new height for Chinese films to open up to the outside world. In addition to the conventional indicators such as "how many Chinese film and television festivals have been held in how many countries" and the changes in the imported film market mentioned just now, there are two phenomena that have industry semiotic significance.
In May 2024, the China Film Joint Booth held a Sino-foreign film cooperation exchange meeting at the China Pavilion in the International Village, looking forward to the new direction and new future of international film cooperation. Source: www.cfcc-film.com.cn
One is that in May last year, the State Film Administration led a team to participate in the 77th Cannes International Film Festival. Two official background activities, "China Film Joint Booth" and "China Youth Film Night", appeared one after another. Jia Zhangke and Guan Hu, two representatives of the sixth generation of directors, participated in the competition, and Hong Kong and Taiwan filmmakers such as Zheng Baorui and Chen Kexin were on the same stage. Some people say that the last time they saw such a large lineup of Chinese filmmakers in Cannes was in 2009. Moreover, this time it was the management department that stood at the forefront, and the filmmakers stood firmly behind the management department out of their high recognition of the party's literary and artistic policies and their strong confidence in the country and nation. Although there were some different voices later, I believe that history will eventually prove that they are simply impossible to constitute an obstacle to questioning the development of Chinese films.
Another one is "The Sinking of the Lisbon Maru" for the Oscar. An old senior who participated in the film selection application said that the film that was originally going to represent mainland China in the Oscars was another film that was popular in early 2024 and had completed all the domestic procedures. The review experts made a temporary decision to withdraw it and replace it with "The Sinking of the Lisbon Maru" - our goal is to show the responsibility of Chinese filmmakers and the peace-loving and people-oriented moral spirit of the Chinese people. This move has received green lights and support from all levels. This is both a historical accident and a historical necessity. At a time when social civilization and the film industry are developing in tandem, it is possible for such a film to be born and, with the support of many invisible forces, represent China to the world.
"The Sinking of the Lisbon Maru" wins Oscar
Internal reform and external opening are mutually reinforcing. The current foreign policy framework of China's film and television industry was set in 2001. It can no longer adapt to the earth-shaking progress we have made in the economy, society, and diplomacy, and needs to be adjusted as soon as possible. As relevant leaders have pointed out, "We must achieve the prosperity of Chinese films in an open atmosphere." In 2024, the Third Plenary Session of the 20th CPC Central Committee proposed to further deepen reforms in an all-round way and promote Chinese-style modernization. We still have to keep returning to the original intention of launching the reform of the cinema system and then the industrialization reform when we joined the WTO: internal reform and external opening. In 2025, I hope that Chinese films can continue to open up new prospects on the road of opening up to the outside world.
What form should movies take?
The Paper: Looking ahead to 2025, this year marks the 130th anniversary of the birth of world cinema and the 120th anniversary of the birth of Chinese cinema. This is undoubtedly a "big year" for the film industry. What suggestions do you have?
Zhi Fina: This year's Spring Festival, Chinese films can be said to be "overall exciting". However, we need to step up investment in production and improve the level of creation in the future, and we must not overdraw the enthusiasm of the audience. In 2024, many filmmakers are "restricted from working". Some people joked that they hope that this year will change the situation where everyone can only take the green train to attend industry meetings.
Providing audiences with a variety of excellent films has always been the purpose of Chinese films. I think this has never changed in the past 120 years.
The Paper: Film, as an artistic medium, has been around for more than a hundred years. To be frank, it is also facing a major change that has not been seen in a century. With the impact of AI, short dramas, and short videos of film commentary, what form should film take?
Zhi Fina: What form should movies take? This is a good question, and a big one. The performance of this Spring Festival period can silence those who think that "Chinese movies are dying" and "movies are not as good as short dramas." But there are still many issues left for Chinese movies.
First of all, what form should film creation take? The big screen will expose all the carelessness of practitioners. I think there are two types of commercial films, one is dream-making and the other is realistic. In recent years, many excellent works have been produced, but there have also been many setbacks. The core is, is the story told well? Screenwriters, directors, photographers, art, post-production, and performances cannot be lazy, and they all have to serve the purpose of telling a good story. In the past few years, "people were stupid and had a lot of money", but now the audience has been "cheated" to be smart, so don't ruin the audience's popularity.
To create dreams, one must have smooth logic, fantastic pictures, and must break through imagination. How well the "Wandering Earth" series, "Nezha" series, and "Detective Chinatown" series are done, and how poorly those "big IPs" that cannot have sequels are done.
To be realistic, you need to "get down to earth" and write about people's pain and happiness. In 2017, the TV drama management department summarized the creative trend of "warm realism" internally. Later, it was promoted by some scholars and became a hot word in the academic community. It also gained wider recognition in the film and television industry and even the literary and art circles. However, some creations in the past two years are afraid of wolves in front and tigers behind. They always want to please both the superiors and the subordinates, to make the experts eat and the audience walk freely, and they don't want to offend this side or the other side, and they are unwilling to face history and dare not face reality. The result is to add layer after layer of beauty filters to life, turning it into "lukewarm realism."
After the industry trough in 2024, it is both a danger and an opportunity. How can some creators still hold on to the so-called artist's reserve and refuse to correct their attitude to listen to the preferences and emotions of the people? Believing in the people, respecting the people, and following the people is the only way for the revival of film and national culture.
Secondly, what form should the film industry take? For a long time, we have only relied on box office, attendance, ticket prices, screenings, and the number of screens to measure the development of the film industry, but the theory and practice of film as an industrial economics are still insufficient. The total box office of this industry is only a few hundred billion yuan a year, which is probably not as high as the annual output value of a top shopping mall. Can the box office truly reflect the value of film in the national economy, cultural heritage, civilization writing, and spiritual comfort? Film is a concrete presentation of national strength and social development. How should its impact on related industries be counted? What indicators can be used to measure the goal of Chinese film to become a powerful country? These issues can no longer be solved blindly.
Thirdly, what form should the film industry take? Chinese films shoulder the responsibility of being an important propaganda front. Since 2003, the state has provided a lot of effective policy support, which is something that filmmakers in many countries envy. But film is not just a propaganda front, it is the most market-oriented cultural industry, and it is also a career that the market has to bear the cost directly. I have some shallow experience in macro film and television management and propaganda management, and I feel that we cannot completely manage films with the thinking of managing propaganda. Practice has repeatedly proved that if we believe in the market, the market will not escape the palm of the Buddha's management. Believing in the market is not inaction, let alone arbitrary action. In recent years, I have dealt with a lot of local management departments. Those places that respect creators and the market have developed the industry very well, and talents and funds are willing to go there. And those places that develop the industry based on the faces of their superiors, as criticized by relevant leaders, have shot a bunch of films that "revolutionize for a lifetime and make 10,000 yuan at the box office." The hot Spring Festival file once again shows that the film industry must be built on the basis of the film industry, and let the audience vote with their feet willingly, so that our propaganda will be effective.
Then, what form should film reviews take? Not only this year's Spring Festival, but also the credibility of film criticism in the past two years is in crisis. It is not that the audience will buy a film just because some expert or big V says it is good. In Yu Hua's words, "the least reliable are the experts" - including me as an expert (laughs). "Red envelope film reviews" and "favor film reviews" are cheap and rampant. How many young people will listen to the lofty cultural elitism?
The evaluation system of some institutions is also "in a very good situation", so it has long been questioned by everyone for being watered down and "guessing the ending without seeing the beginning". At the same time, the private film evaluation credit system has not been established. Some platforms control investment, publicity and ticket sales, and participate in scheduling and ratings, which has caused a lot of dissatisfaction in the industry and the audience. Even some websites where young artists gather have been accused of "having black water" for a long time. So whether it is official or private, there is indeed a distance between the evaluation system of the film and television industry and the audience's personal feelings, and it is even separated.
Also, what form should cinemas take? One cinema manager said that he had originally planned to close down after the Spring Festival, but "Nezha 2" made him feel that he could still hold on until the 2026 Spring Festival, which revealed the truth that many cinemas "depend on the weather for their livelihood."
During this year's Spring Festival, some cinemas set a record for the highest number of screenings in a single day (up to 99 screenings of "Nezha" were scheduled in one day, with an average of one show every 10 minutes), and many screenings were full.
The attendance rate of Chinese cinemas has dropped year by year from 18% in 2015 to 8% in 2024, and 15% is the lifeline of cinemas. The low attendance rate is related to the lack of excellent films, the high pressure of people's lives and more entertainment methods, and the too fast construction of cinemas. In the past few years, the market developed well and hot money was invested in the construction of cinemas. In 2016, the number of screens in China exceeded that of the United States, ranking first in the world. In recent years, it has continued to increase, and by the end of 2024, it has exceeded 90,000, accounting for about 2/5 of the total number of screens in the world. This shows that although the attendance rate has declined, the market has not lost confidence in cinemas.
However, there are about 1,500 cinemas and 9,000 screens in the country that are "zombies" that have been unable to operate for a long time and have not been deregistered by the management department. In addition, there are many inefficient cinemas with annual turnover of less than 2 million yuan that are "half dead". As mentioned earlier, Hollywood, Japan and South Korea have already changed their tracks. Some managers still believe that the more cinemas the better based on their personal experience in the last century, and some operators are still lazy and lying down to make money. Therefore, it is necessary to accelerate the high-quality development of cinemas, eliminate "old, broken and small" and irregularly operated cinemas, and "let the damn ones die."
Movies will continue to absorb new audio-visual technologies for their own use and will not be replaced. Social significance, experience, high quality of audio and video equipment, and immersion and identification with stories in a confined space cannot be replaced by new technologies. However, cinemas must have high-standard services, unique personality labels and business strategies. We must fully realize that today's cinemas are not only viewing spaces, but also social spaces, and can also be a carrier for experiencing various arts such as concerts, events, and games.
So, back to your question, what form should movies take? To borrow a phrase from the recent "News Broadcast", Chinese movies should be a "barometer of China's economy". The output value of several hundred billion yuan is only its surface value. Its deep-level value and significance cannot be measured by box office alone. Our confidence in it is not only our confidence in Chinese culture, but also our confidence in the Chinese economy. This confidence has never wavered since the 20th National Congress of the Communist Party of China.
